Category: Let's talk
Today we were unlucky enough to come across a real eejit while having our morning stroll beside the river we came across a family and the Father was being really rough with his little boy who was 3yrs old and trying to explore there is a secure fence beside the river so he was safe from the water.
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Admittedly the boy was being difficult,but the Father who stood at 6ft 3 grabbed his hand and hauled his arm upwards so the child's feet were almost off the ground! Ardeth told him what she thought of his treatment but recieved no reply he didn't seem to care, he then smacked his son hard on the arse for the 2nd time and picked him up as if he was a bag of bloody coal! The boy was screaming for his Mother I assume in fear and she damn well ignored his protests ...if we come across these idiots again they will be getting more than the rough edge of my tongue.
Some people jkust shouldn't have kids. Geez.
Agreed he seemed completely unmoved by our reaction I couldn't believe his cheek I also wonder what kind of life this child will have.
Unloving parents make unloving children half the time.
I think we should be very careful before jumping to conclusions on how a child is, or is not being treated. Whilst I would be the first to criticise if I thought a child was being abused, I also know that children can try your patience to the absolute limit sometimes, and can cause you to overreact. And I also know that different people have different views on how children should, and should not be disciplined. There are those who, for example, think that to smack a child is child abuce and that those children should be taken into social services care and the parents porsicuted for the offence, but there are those of us who think that, in certain circumstances, a smack, and i emphasise, smack, because there is a vast difference between smacking a child, and beating a child, is acceptable. So whilst maybe this man's actions towards his child were perhaps a litle overboard, lets not forget that we are all human, and lets not also forget that if we all acted on what we thought was wrong, a lot of blind people would have been reported to social services by now, because there are still a lot of people out there who feel that disabled people shouldn't be allowed to have children, and we all know that not to be the case.
we know abuse when we see it because I have seen the lasting effects of childhood abuse in my partner and brother, Ardeth was shaking when she saw this child being hit and handled so roughly by this overgrown bully and there are very few things that make my partner react like that...furthermore there is absolutely NO! excuse for hitting a child,in doing so you have lost the battle and they bloody well know it, plus you are also teaching them that violence is the answer to every problem and perpetuating the cycle of violence..do we want to teach our children to use their fists to get their own way I certainly dont.
you could potentially be opening up a very large debate here ... to smack or not to smack, because the world is very divided on this issue, whilst some people do believe that smacking is wrong, it is their personal opinion, and there are others that believe that, in some circumstances, a tap on the wrist or the leg or the bottom is not harmful to a child. I was certainly smacked as a child and it never did me any harm. Personally I have never had to smack my own son, there are other forms of disciplin which I find more effective - the bottom step of the stairs in my house has great effect and Nathan is sent there if he has done something wrong, but there are some who feel this is also wrong as, by isolating a child, you are doing them harm as well so ... either way, you can't win!
Fine I will take whatever comes my way.
That's the problem many adults are too fond of saying "It never did me any harm" as if they can hold themselves up as a fine example, but all they are doing is condoning their parents actions and saying its ok to physically hit a child once you raise your hand to a child you have begun the process of destroying their trust and that is fundamentally wrong!
That's so mean! I've heard about that kind of thing happening before and it's just not acceptable. Though it's not a major form of abuse, it's still abuse! I don't agree with that at all, and if you see them again, Goblin, let them have it lol! Hit them with your cane!!!
I personally feel that it is entirely up to the parents when and how they discipline their own children, and I don't think any passing do-gooders should interfere and tell other people what to do. Especially when they don't have any experience themselves of bringing up a child. I'm with Sugarbaby on this one. Frey.
Dont bloody temp me pal! I was close to it but your man wasn't worth an asault charge.
Dont bloody temp me pal! I was close to it but your man wasn't worth an asault charge.
I remember as a child being told I was useless, worthless, stupid, various other things ... not on a regular basis don't get me wrong, but I remember these instances far better than the times I was smacked, verbal chastisement can have a far greater, and more damaging effect on a child than one quick tap which is then forgotten. as for having your say to the individual, if you'd stopped me and told me that I was doing the wrong thing by my child in your view, I'd have told you to get stuffed, what is wrong to one, isn't wrong to another. I for instance think that it's wrong to put a child into nursery from the age of 6 months and go back to work, but millions do it and the government pays for them to do it!
sugar baby you made some good points. I don't agree with you o n the putting a baby in nursery or day care as we call it. So what is the parents to do, stay home and live off of wellfare? If they don't have anyone else to take care of the baby while they are making money to raise this child then I think all the more power for putting them in day care and trying to make a life for there child! You know if they were staying home with the child and not working or making any money, they would be put down for that also. I bet if you would give them money to raise there child they wouold be more than happy to stay home and bond with there new baby! smile angel
Hehe, bottomline poor eole who can't afford to have babies shouldn't since they're damned if they go out and use daycare and damned if they stay home.
It's a tricky business. You need to be strict with your child but also to talk with them and understand, I think it's hard to find the right middle, I got a tap or two when I was little but never anything serious or threatening and I was never afraid. Of course I'm not claiming to be the best raied person in the world, not at all but I've done decently for myself so far. I think I'd really avoid using any physical punishment, spaking and the like, I don't believe in it working, but I also don't believe in having the child get his/her way with everything and not point it out when something he/she is doing is totally wrong.
cheers
-B
no I do realize that there are people out there who have no choice but to put their child into daycare and go to work, I wasn't having a go at those people, I was just raising the point that some people disagree with the way certain people do certain things, but yet, for those people those are the things that work. As for physical punishment i think it should be an absolute last resort, and by physical punishment I mean only a tap on the wrist or bottom, I would never condone, for example, hitting a child with a belt, slipper, or some such implement. But the problem is that we have now ended up with a no disciplin culture, and the result of that is that we have a high rate of juvinile crime, and children who have a "you can't touch me" mentality.
Sugar .. agreed 100%
yeah, sugar baby i agree with you then! sorry I must have taken it the wrong way! Yeah, it kills me when you are at the grocery store and a kid is acting up and throwing a fit and the parents are just like baby now stop that or buying them what they want to just shut them up! That is when i think it is the parents decision to punish them, but at the same time if the parent in that same situation would have tapped him as you said, it would have been wrong in some eyes! Dammed if they do and dammed if they don't! i think as long as it don't go to far, it should be up to the parents to choose there way of disiplin. In this I mean they shouldn't have to worry about what somene is going to say to them for the way they are choosing to punish them. dam, now a days if you spank a child and someone sees it and doesn't agree with spanking, you would be investigated and the whole drawn out thing. I was never spanked as a child, but I knew when I had gone to far. I just got that look from my dad and knew enough was enough! lol! The evil look! lol! My parents were famous for grounding! Dam, why couldn't they just spank me and get it over, instead of drawing it out for weeks! lol! smile, angel
I agree on the subject of kids in the grocery store that parents give into for a quieter life, thing is though, before you have a child you have all these pre conceived ideas about how things should be done. And then once you have a child you realize that it isn't always that simple, and that you have to be very strong if you want to stick to the way you intended to do things. My mother thinks I'm way way too hard on Nathan, and yet I've never smacked him, and everyone says what a polite, well-behaved child he is, I don't think I'm too hard on him - I just think there have to be boundaries, and those boundaries have to be set from the outset.
I agree with Sugar Baby and the others on this one. I got spankings, and I think only one was overboard, but that's a different story all together. However, I also know my manners, and how to behave politely; unlike so dam many in this country. When my Mom spanked me I was left with no question as to why I was getting spanked, and accept for that once I could never say I was really hurt. Did I lose trust in my Mom? No. To this day I'd trust her with my life! Why you may ask? Because she showed me she cared in everything she did. Including her insistance that I not become a hellian. Before anyone asks, no, I don't have any children myself, however, I'd pretty much raised my Dad's youngest children, so, I think I have a fair idea of my limits and so on...
Yeap, raising kids is so easy in theory. I think I know exactly how to handle it, I'm sure if/when I am faced with a screaming baby I will have zip zero idea of what to do. I think we have to figure it out as we go along, but in general I agree with SugarBaby, we need to show kids the meaning of respect and duties, not out of fear but out of the notion of discipline. I've seen people who raise their kids in fear of extreme spanking etc and never talk to them, I can't imagine that leading to anything good, parents who e.g. say falt out no to letting the kid ever try anything like e.g. a zip of beer or something, they don't explain the dangers involved and they sort of exclude the kid from their lives. I was always allowed a sneak peak at my parents life, they gave me may be half a shot of beer or red wine when they had some when I turned 7 or 8 and I played around with my dad's razor since I was 4 and thought it was so cool. This way I figure out red wine tasted awful and I was never tempted into the whole drinking/doing something cause it is not allowed, thing in elementary school, I had tried it and just wasn't interested. Another thing I think is important is to get your kid a career/hobby, let them try out a sport or music lessong, preferibly both, it's a great source of being in a team, making friends and acquiring something special. If it hadn't been for my parents insisting I started training swimming and playing the piano I would never have made it so far in the world and I wouldn't have all those wonderful firnds that I have today, most of whom are my swim team mates, and I wouldn't have spent all this ridiculous amount of money on guitars, amps, keyboards and drums :) but, hey, it's way better than drugs and alcohol. :) I'm just very thakful for the way I was raised and I'd love to try and give someone else the same upbringing, if it ever came to that. :)
cheers
-B
Hi. Yeah I guess I kind of do agree that it's no one's business. But if a child is screaming histerically, I wouldn't just walk on by! That's just ... I don't know. I just feel that's not right. A little spank is one thing, I wouldn't yell at someone over that. But if you're like, wrastling with a child and the child is getting visibly upset and histerical, I think that's kind of different. I don't mean to offend anyone but this is what I think. And I do admit I wouldn't know, beingo nly fourteen myself, and of course I've never raised a child. But yeah.
Caitlin
the thing is though, a two year old can scream histerically because ... well because he's a two year old, it's what they do sometimes, to get their own way or whatever, so to interveen would not necessarily be the right course of action, sometimes, you just have to ignore it.
If I catch someone hitting their child I will risk being insulted however, I also know the terrible effect of verbal abuse and the deep scars that kind of ignorance can inflict no child should ever have to endure that..
But we have a plan for the little man in the form of cold lumpy sticky porridge,when he swears or misbehaves he will be plonked down in front of a bowl and will not be allowed to leave until he's eaten it.
If I catch someone hitting their child I will risk being insulted however, I also know the terrible effect of verbal abuse and the deep scars that kind of ignorance can inflict no child should ever have to endure that..
But we have a plan for the little man in the form of cold lumpy sticky porridge,when he swears or misbehaves he will be plonked down in front of a bowl and will not be allowed to leave until he's eaten it.
just wait for the little man to turn into a big man and then see how you get on, don't see the porridge working somehow but there you go.
yeh, good luck with making your toddler eat something he has no intention of eating, the theory is a good one, the practice, however, another matter.
I'm aware of that we have the hassle already with Louis who becomes quite stroppy when he can't be bothered doing something we would like him to like not tipping paint..or water over girls who refuse to hand back his musical dragon.
Yeah Sugarbaby you're right. To intervene would be bad if the two year old was just screaming. But if you could see that the situation was getting seriously out of hand and could lead to serious pain for the child...Well...I would say something. I wouldn't be able to help it.
agreed 100% with everything Sugarbaby has said! .. I am personally against smacking a child, but that's just me and where a debate sure lies.
and Goblin, Lol poor you with Louis! sounds like you've got a handful! Lol
ok well for those that say they would interveen or say something or whatever think about it like this ... let's say you were in a supermarket with your child and that child was seriously misbehaving. You refuse to give in to the child and the child, in this instance a toddler, throws himself to the floor and starts banging his head against the floor, and that is not an impossible senario - my own child has never acted in this way, but i do know several children who do. now, you can't just leave the child there, in a public place, with people looking on, so you lift the child up off the floor, kicking, screaming, and thrashing about. someone walks past and only sees the last bit, a screming, kicking child in your arms, trying to get away, and jumps to the conclusion that you are behaving heavy-handedly with that child, when, in actual fact, what you are trying to do is to calm him down. That individual then thinks the child is in danger and reports you to the police, and to social services. There is an investigation, your child is possibly taken into care while this investigation is carried out, and for that period you are given supervised access only to your child. What effect do you think that will have on the child, and on the rest of the family, long-term. Even if you are proven to be a fit parent, the scars will remain for ever. So just think about what pepercussions there could be, someone giving a child a smack in public might be doing just that, don't be too quick to draw conclusions.
If Alasdair has a daft turn in a supermarket I would get down beside him and try to calm the little man that way..because I know from Dad's experience with me once that dragging the child off the floor just increases their anger, because they feel trapped in your arms..they just want to get away from the horrible adult who wont buy that "essential" sweet ect and I would stay sitting on the floor until he'd stopped screaming as difficult as that might be...however I do understand what your saying ..
and what if the screaming just went on and on for say hmmmm half an hour or so? I'm afraid toddlers don't respond that sort of thing.
I've learned to be patient believe me I can wait he will run out of steam eventually .
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Rd..Louis is just like his Father a feckin rascal and quick on the uptake.. we love him really.Grin.
I've learned to be patient believe me I can wait he will run out of steam eventually .
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Rd..Louis is just like his Father a feckin rascal and quick on the uptake.. we love him really.Grin.
Hmmmm shurely some mishtake there....Ed.
Hi Sugarbaby, As for the whole scenario with intervening if you saw a child being mistreated, here's what i have to say. If I were to see a child actually being hit or whatever, and thus crying with pain, i would say something. But if the child was just thrashing about and screaming and no abuse had been viewed by my own eyes, I obviously would never say anything, I know how young children can be. But if you see a child being physically mistreated, maybe I wouldnt' say somethign myself, but I wouldn't just let the child suffer. But I wouldn't see any of this anyway, but if I heard some child being hit you know? Oh forget it. I know I'm probably in the wrong here.
Caitlin
recently there was a story in the news where a man had smacked his 3-year-old son because he had run out into the road. This incident was witnessed by an off-duty police officer who reported the man to the police for child abuce. The social services were involved, and while the man waited for his hearing, an injunction was taken out against him preventing him from coming anywhere near his children, that is, a 3-year-old, and a new born baby, until the case was heard. The man was not allowed to see his children unsupervised for 6 months, and in the end, all charges against him were dropped.